Creating In The Larger Reality with Michael Wann & Jenny Rivers
Syncromystic sage Michael Wann and energy healer Jenny Rivers join us on Vibe Rant tonight to talk about the Living Matrix (the eternal womb), and how to make room in our energy fields for the expanding of Life Force.
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In this episode
Core themes
The Cosmic Womb and the Living Matrix
Chance opened by saying the larger reality we are returning to is the cosmic womb or cosmic egg, and he pointed out that a womb is a matrix. Jenny said she had never connected the living matrix with a womb and that she would be chewing on the idea of wombs within wombs. Later Chance described life as fractal, with life force energy expressing itself similarly across scale, and he linked that to rings in a tree, the tree of life and the cosmic egg model.
Reptilians, Serpents, and Hosts of Energy
Chance said he had been reluctant to look at reptilians until he read Pierre Sabak, whose polyglottal puns he described as linking words for serpents, watchers, angels and sailors. Chance wondered whether serpent beings might be energy columns like a spine, and he called bodies hosts for life force. Jenny said she knew little about lizard people but felt they would be part of the oneness. Michael wondered who designed the blind spot in human consciousness and said the reptilian narrative might fit there.
Demons, Division, and Inner Integration
Chance argued that demonic means two or divided, and that compartmentalized energy creates stagnation. Michael recounted a friend's view that opening chakras can invite demonic activity, comparing it to leaving windows down in a parked car. Jenny disagreed with treating demons as outsiders, saying the dark forces live within us too, and she tied the serpent to the demonized feminine. Chance added that inner alchemy meant putting the pieces of yourself back where they belong, and the group joked about a thank your demon day.
The Moon, the Sun, and Seeing Differently
Michael said he did not know what the moon was, and he argued that the value lay in putting attention on something outside the closed loop system of culture. He described the new moon as the moon and sun rising together, and the full moon as the opposite. Chance relayed Benjamin Balderson's view of the earth, sun and moon as a galvanic cell with a masculine Luna and a feminine Sol. Jenny described watching old beliefs fall away, and Chance noted that many cultures treated the moon as masculine.
Mythology, Stories, and Creating Your Own System
Rachel asked how much stock to put in astrological mythology, and Jenny answered that she and Michael were moving into a post lineage space. Michael described what he called objective astrology, treating the natal chart as a time marker. Chance said mythology may have encoded an alchemical process but warned against attachment to stories, and Jenny added that the story and the mystery can both be honored. Michael and Jenny later described their starboard and an upcoming star quilt, urging listeners to make their own.
Quotes
“And like water, it takes the shape of its container, its vessel, and that if you have a vessel that's cracked or compartmentalized, where some of that energy is not flowing in circulation with the rest, then like water, you create stagnation. And in a sense, you create a demonic consciousness because demonic means two or divided.”
“Are we attached to a story or is it something real that the story reflects? And in either way, we talk about getting out of artificial realities and rejoining the larger reality, we want to stop believing fiction is truth and let truth be truth, right?”
“So that the reason why this is an oppression energy is because it's the super ego psychologically. It is the voice of the crowd that is in your head, but you don't even realize where it's coming from. And you think it's you.”
“I wanted to do that little divination for us, though, to help us with the idea of oppression energy and realize that it's the idea that we need to like do everything for everybody else and feed them our life force energy that's causing us to feel oppressed.”
“Like the whole human experience, there's a blind spot. And what I mean by that is, there's something we don't know. Because if we knew it, we wouldn't have these questions. But once you realize you have a blind spot, then you have to come to this realization, if you can do it, is like, I got no idea how big that blind spot is.”
“That's what the value is. So it's not so much like what the specific details are, but the more you learn about something, the more you observe and the more you can look at it in a different way, all that's doing is fine tuning your capability of taking consciousness and seeing things differently outside of the dimension of created ideological reality.”
“And I recognize that as being significant, but then having the openness of saying like, I'm not certain what that significance is, but to me, what I think is important is it as a time marker. So like at the most basic level, it's time marking.”
“And like, even as we're talking about what demons are is we're separating ourselves from that saying like those over there, those are the dark entities and we're the good ones. And I, you know, we have to be all of it. And so there's these dark forces but they're within us too.”
“But I think right now we have this opportunity to like enter into this like post lineage space. And I think that you're discovering that for yourself right now is like what's your mythology or like what's your post lineage astrological understanding of all of these different energies because that's just like one person.”
“But the mythology is part of the narrative, whether you like it or not. It does play with the mind. When people are like, oh, I identify with Lilith, like, yeah, you're putting that into yourself.”
“I think the only point to know anything of the past is to work with it now because I met people who do all these past life regressions and then they live in that space. They're like, well, I was this thing. I'm like, okay, you were that thing. What are you now? How are you using any of this?”
“Well, essentially I've been focusing primarily on the major arcana. And I've found so many things just in that layer that I'm a little afraid to get into the minor arcana.”
“And, you know, it's got the four corners, the four seasons, the four winds. And it also encodes that turning, that changing the turning of seasons. You know, that rota is written on the shield there.”
Gabriel, known on air as Slick Dissident, co-hosts InnerVerse's Vibe Rant show and is a longtime recurring guest on the podcast. He teaches occult symbolism and tarot on his YouTube channel, ranging across the Major Arcana, the esoteric Enneagram, mythology and archetype, mystic linguistics, and the symbolism hidden in popular film. He is best known for Tarot-tories, his own system mapping the 22 Major Arcana and zodiac archetypes onto the geography of the United States.
See all Gabe episodes→Kyle and Serena Denton are community herbalists creating wild-crafted and organic plant medicines out of Milwaukee since 2015. I have used their teas and tinctures on an almost daily basis for years now. Kyle is a great friend of InnerVerse and has appeared on the channel more times than I can count. These products work, not in the allopathic "pharma-medicine" way, but in a terrain-support, consciousness bolstering plant-teacher sort of way.
